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Tony Blair: If the will of the people shifts ...

Tony Blair: If the will of the people shifts ...

(1:34) Former prime minister Tony Blair, speaking on Radio 4's 'The World This Weekend', said the country should keep its Brexit options open. July 3, 2016.

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TheBob TheBob (746 days ago)

Oh my god, I find myself agreeing with Blair. Where's it all going to end?

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Oh my god, I find myself agreeing with Blair. Where's it all going to end?

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Guest: Fred234 (746 days ago)

You must be a war criminal as well then!

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You must be a war criminal as well then!

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Guest: (745 days ago)

Democracy means two idiots can out vote one Einstein, and one Blair can out vote 17 million citizens

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Democracy means two idiots can out vote one Einstein, and one Blair can out vote 17 million citizens

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Guest: Jim Mooman (742 days ago)

The cause of the worlds currwent troubles are here .... and will they him and the others who benefit ever be brought to justice .... No .... millions have died , the trust between man and man has been eroded by him and his self satisfying friends

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The cause of the worlds currwent troubles are here .... and will they him and the others who benefit ever be brought to justice .... No .... millions have died , the trust between man and man has been eroded by him and his self satisfying friends

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Guest: Jim Mooman (742 days ago)

And the when that they caught red handed ... and Yes it will comeuppance that they others for trusting ... for the worlds mwillions , who and idiots cannot any more be blameless and less.

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And the when that they caught red handed ... and Yes it will comeuppance that they others for trusting ... for the worlds mwillions , who and idiots cannot any more be blameless and less.

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Guest: noname (746 days ago)

Democracy in action, people vote until government is satisfied with the decision.

Is that Value worth spreading around the world? :)

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Democracy in action, people vote until government is satisfied with the decision.

Is that Value worth spreading around the world? :)

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Guest: European (746 days ago)

Unfortunately ‘democracy’ often involves letting people of very limited education and intellect make decisions based on the misinformation and lies that they are being fed by manipulative puppet masters who tend to prey on their fears and prejudices in order to advance their own agendas.

I think it is now very clear that Boris only entered on the ‘Leave’ side because he thought it would advance his political aspirations whilst it only took Nigel Farage minutes to backtrack on the ‘350 million for the NHS’ lie on ’Good Morning Britain’.

If it becomes very obvious in the coming months and years that the UK will be much worse off outside the EU than within it and that many of those who voted ‘Leave’ are having serious doubts about their choice would it not be madness not to do something about it rather than stick rigidly to some idealised version of what ‘democracy’ stands for?

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Unfortunately ‘democracy’ often involves letting people of very limited education and intellect make decisions based on the misinformation and lies that they are being fed by manipulative puppet masters who tend to prey on their fears and prejudices in order to advance their own agendas.

I think it is now very clear that Boris only entered on the ‘Leave’ side because he thought it would advance his political aspirations whilst it only took Nigel Farage minutes to backtrack on the ‘350 million for the NHS’ lie on ’Good Morning Britain’.

If it becomes very obvious in the coming months and years that the UK will be much worse off outside the EU than within it and that many of those who voted ‘Leave’ are having serious doubts about their choice would it not be madness not to do something about it rather than stick rigidly to some idealised version of what ‘democracy’ stands for?

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Guest: Fred234 (746 days ago)

Well there are plenty of university graduates (even scientists rather than golf course managers) who voted out.

Repetitive referenda until the 'right answer' is achieved is a technique often used by the EU. Little wonder that Tony B Liar is following the same route, after all, he wanted to be the first EU President and gave away a large part of our rebate as a bribe and would have put us in the Euro if it wasn't for Gordon Brown.

Nothing that B.Lair says is worth the oxygen he abuses.

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Well there are plenty of university graduates (even scientists rather than golf course managers) who voted out.

Repetitive referenda until the 'right answer' is achieved is a technique often used by the EU. Little wonder that Tony B Liar is following the same route, after all, he wanted to be the first EU President and gave away a large part of our rebate as a bribe and would have put us in the Euro if it wasn't for Gordon Brown.

Nothing that B.Lair says is worth the oxygen he abuses.

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Guest: European (746 days ago)

Well just because 'the people' have spoken doesn't mean they've made the right decision.

And if it turns out they've made the wrong decision should anything be done about it?

Or should the people be forced to live with their decision regardless of the consequences and console themselves that at least they live in a democracy?

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Well just because 'the people' have spoken doesn't mean they've made the right decision.

And if it turns out they've made the wrong decision should anything be done about it?

Or should the people be forced to live with their decision regardless of the consequences and console themselves that at least they live in a democracy?

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Guest: noname (746 days ago)

There are legal ways, that respect both will of the people and the law, but it looks like you are for "London spring", UK version of Arab spring.

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There are legal ways, that respect both will of the people and the law, but it looks like you are for "London spring", UK version of Arab spring.

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Guest: European (746 days ago)

Where did I suggest I was in favour of anything illegal or any kind of uprising?

And is wilfully lying to and misleading the people illegal?

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Where did I suggest I was in favour of anything illegal or any kind of uprising?

And is wilfully lying to and misleading the people illegal?

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Guest: (745 days ago)

I think the British people should be made to live with their decision. Even to the keen Brexit camp, it will continue to get harder and harder to justify the vote. When it's shown that Brexit will have no discernible effect on immigration, and the full economic downturn has played out, and when they are firmly denied access to the single market, they will all start squirming. It's a big price to pay but some people aren't politically aware enough to learn the lesson in any other way.

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I think the British people should be made to live with their decision. Even to the keen Brexit camp, it will continue to get harder and harder to justify the vote. When it's shown that Brexit will have no discernible effect on immigration, and the full economic downturn has played out, and when they are firmly denied access to the single market, they will all start squirming. It's a big price to pay but some people aren't politically aware enough to learn the lesson in any other way.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

Immigration and single market go hand in hand. No single market, no uncontrolled EU immigration to UK.

I don't know why people believe that UK will sink like Atlantis without EU, or that EU is bastion of strength without a crack?

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Immigration and single market go hand in hand. No single market, no uncontrolled EU immigration to UK.

I don't know why people believe that UK will sink like Atlantis without EU, or that EU is bastion of strength without a crack?

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Guest: (745 days ago)

Load of crap. EU immigration is controlled by laws set by the EU and now it will be controlled by the tories. The tories have already shown they cannot control non-eu immigration.. why do you think this will be different? Anyway the brits are so dependent on the single market (all the leave camp say they can still have it) it looks like free movement will still be on the cards. HAHA! NNo one is saying UK will sink completely. Just that it was better off potically and financically being in. No one is saying that EU has no cracks. Just that its still better being in. Straw man arguments. Try again. Any the proof is in the pudding and we can all see your pudding is already looking burnt.

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Load of crap. EU immigration is controlled by laws set by the EU and now it will be controlled by the tories. The tories have already shown they cannot control non-eu immigration.. why do you think this will be different? Anyway the brits are so dependent on the single market (all the leave camp say they can still have it) it looks like free movement will still be on the cards. HAHA! NNo one is saying UK will sink completely. Just that it was better off potically and financically being in. No one is saying that EU has no cracks. Just that its still better being in. Straw man arguments. Try again. Any the proof is in the pudding and we can all see your pudding is already looking burnt.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

EU laws are useless when you dill with migrants willing to risk their lives only to enter and stay in EU. Until there is a belt of stable states on EU borders from Ukraine to Morocco, no one will be able to stop them, that won't happen in next 20 years.

First off politicians didn't have willingness to dill with the immigration problem and they still don't, so we are getting to my initial argument, politician are sacrificing democracy in order to get what they want, and there are a lot of helpers.

Most of the losses were in EU assets, that says a lot. ;)

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EU laws are useless when you dill with migrants willing to risk their lives only to enter and stay in EU. Until there is a belt of stable states on EU borders from Ukraine to Morocco, no one will be able to stop them, that won't happen in next 20 years.

First off politicians didn't have willingness to dill with the immigration problem and they still don't, so we are getting to my initial argument, politician are sacrificing democracy in order to get what they want, and there are a lot of helpers.

Most of the losses were in EU assets, that says a lot. ;)

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Guest: Ouch (745 days ago)

Maybe, but if anyone voted leave from the EU just over immigration, then that's the epitomy of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

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Maybe, but if anyone voted leave from the EU just over immigration, then that's the epitomy of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

No one knows, adverse consequences from migration crisis will not be known for 10 to 20 years.

If integration is successful, then you will be right, if not (from our perspective it's more plausible option) EU will be highly destabilized place.

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No one knows, adverse consequences from migration crisis will not be known for 10 to 20 years.

If integration is successful, then you will be right, if not (from our perspective it's more plausible option) EU will be highly destabilized place.

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Guest: (745 days ago)

According to the leave camp the consequences for the migrant crisis will be a DECREASING number of migrants going to the uk now it is in charge of its own borders. That is the principal reason why so many small minded people vote to leave. A very clear conclusion will be drawn very soon. Either the numbers go down or there are a lot of gullible bigots in the country that beleived the wrong lie.

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According to the leave camp the consequences for the migrant crisis will be a DECREASING number of migrants going to the uk now it is in charge of its own borders. That is the principal reason why so many small minded people vote to leave. A very clear conclusion will be drawn very soon. Either the numbers go down or there are a lot of gullible bigots in the country that beleived the wrong lie.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

People have said what they want, politicians don't care.

UK is still in EU and won't be in charge of it borders for some time, if ever. Your reasoning is fallacy.

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People have said what they want, politicians don't care.

UK is still in EU and won't be in charge of it borders for some time, if ever. Your reasoning is fallacy.

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Guest: (745 days ago)

If the UK is never in charge of its borders then the leave campangne have made another lie and half the uk have voted on the basis of that lie. if they are in charge of there borders in 2 years or 5 years or whenever and imigration doesnt go down then again they have lied and the voters beleved it. Its called being accountable for the promises you make. Did they really think we would forget the promises they made? It will be an easy one to prove.

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If the UK is never in charge of its borders then the leave campangne have made another lie and half the uk have voted on the basis of that lie. if they are in charge of there borders in 2 years or 5 years or whenever and imigration doesnt go down then again they have lied and the voters beleved it. Its called being accountable for the promises you make. Did they really think we would forget the promises they made? It will be an easy one to prove.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

Dude, are you blind, how many times do I need to repeat?

Politicians don't want to enforce brexit and will of the people, because it is not in their interest and interest of big business.

What you see is strong pushback from the elite to minimize importance of referendum and everything you present as evidence or as a parameter, is collusion of remain camp, big business and maybe some from leave camp to abolish democracy.

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Dude, are you blind, how many times do I need to repeat?

Politicians don't want to enforce brexit and will of the people, because it is not in their interest and interest of big business.

What you see is strong pushback from the elite to minimize importance of referendum and everything you present as evidence or as a parameter, is collusion of remain camp, big business and maybe some from leave camp to abolish democracy.

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Guest: Blinded by the light (745 days ago)

Well, if you're going to stereotype, you can't really promote the "will of the people" as a valid argument when the defining majority of the leavers were babyboomers with a fond recollection of Albion and its majestic past and brought up on "Love thy Neighbour".

"What you see is strong pushback from the ignorant to minimize importance of balanced thought, cohesive argument and everything you present as evidence or as a parameter, is indicative of leave camp; small-mindedness, and desire from Leave camp to abolish rational thought."

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Well, if you're going to stereotype, you can't really promote the "will of the people" as a valid argument when the defining majority of the leavers were babyboomers with a fond recollection of Albion and its majestic past and brought up on "Love thy Neighbour".

"What you see is strong pushback from the ignorant to minimize importance of balanced thought, cohesive argument and everything you present as evidence or as a parameter, is indicative of leave camp; small-mindedness, and desire from Leave camp to abolish rational thought."

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

You don't seem to understand or don't care how democracy works.

In your head there are less worthy people, who should hurry up and die, and let you The Smart One decide everything.

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You don't seem to understand or don't care how democracy works.

In your head there are less worthy people, who should hurry up and die, and let you The Smart One decide everything.

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Guest: (745 days ago)

"You are for robbing people of their will."

Am I?

I thought I was in favour of people being able to express their will based on being supplied with all the facts and truths of a situation.

Your version of 'democracy' seems to be one where even if it turns out that people were lied to and presented with untruths and incorrect 'facts' upon which they made their decision, once they've voted that's the end of it.

Doesn't seem like a very fair or sound 'democracy' to me.

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"You are for robbing people of their will."

Am I?

I thought I was in favour of people being able to express their will based on being supplied with all the facts and truths of a situation.

Your version of 'democracy' seems to be one where even if it turns out that people were lied to and presented with untruths and incorrect 'facts' upon which they made their decision, once they've voted that's the end of it.

Doesn't seem like a very fair or sound 'democracy' to me.

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

O, The Smart One, let it be thy will....

There was plenty of time to say what you want. Government, with its propaganda, was on your side, and you still lost.

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O, The Smart One, let it be thy will....

There was plenty of time to say what you want. Government, with its propaganda, was on your side, and you still lost.

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Guest: European (744 days ago)

I didn't lose anything.

I'm neither British or resident in the UK.

No skin off my nose whichever way the vote went.

But just out of interest what would your stance be if many of the groups / people who campaigned in favour of 'leave' came out and demanded a revote on the basis that they were lied to?

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Original comment

I didn't lose anything.

I'm neither British or resident in the UK.

No skin off my nose whichever way the vote went.

But just out of interest what would your stance be if many of the groups / people who campaigned in favour of 'leave' came out and demanded a revote on the basis that they were lied to?

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Guest: noname (743 days ago)

My concern is more about democracy and respect for its rules, than outcome of the vote, remain or leave.

Irony is that without brexit, some basic principles of EU will be gone. EU will no longer be something that member nations willingly accept. It will be prison of nations.

Without brexit, you lose.

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My concern is more about democracy and respect for its rules, than outcome of the vote, remain or leave.

Irony is that without brexit, some basic principles of EU will be gone. EU will no longer be something that member nations willingly accept. It will be prison of nations.

Without brexit, you lose.

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Guest: European (743 days ago)

Wouldn't one of the most basic rules of a democracy be that people aren't mislead and lied to in the process of running that democracy?

Surely such a system is a democracy in name only and the truth is that the people (the 'demos') are being manipulated in order to provide whatever result certain interests want.

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Wouldn't one of the most basic rules of a democracy be that people aren't mislead and lied to in the process of running that democracy?

Surely such a system is a democracy in name only and the truth is that the people (the 'demos') are being manipulated in order to provide whatever result certain interests want.

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Guest: (743 days ago)

No. In any democracy politicians are accused of lying. It's always been the way. Even in general elections one side accuses the other of deception and manipulation. The democratic part is that the voters get to try to figure out who is lying rather than a decision being foisted on them.

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Original comment

No. In any democracy politicians are accused of lying. It's always been the way. Even in general elections one side accuses the other of deception and manipulation. The democratic part is that the voters get to try to figure out who is lying rather than a decision being foisted on them.

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Guest: European (743 days ago)

Yes but there is a difference between being 'accused of' and it being a fact.

Politicians will always 'spin' things to their advantage but that different than telling downright lies which end up frightening and confusing some people into voting a certain way on a once in a lifetime, first past the post, critical issue.

You could almost say people had a decision foisted on them without them even knowing it.

But that's alright because at least they think they live in a democracy and they got to vote.

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Original comment

Yes but there is a difference between being 'accused of' and it being a fact.

Politicians will always 'spin' things to their advantage but that different than telling downright lies which end up frightening and confusing some people into voting a certain way on a once in a lifetime, first past the post, critical issue.

You could almost say people had a decision foisted on them without them even knowing it.

But that's alright because at least they think they live in a democracy and they got to vote.

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Guest: (742 days ago)

What you consider a downright lie, the other party may consider spin, and vice versa. That's basically what politics is. There are very few facts. In a democracy, it's down to the people to decide who to believe and they can vote accordingly.

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What you consider a downright lie, the other party may consider spin, and vice versa. That's basically what politics is. There are very few facts. In a democracy, it's down to the people to decide who to believe and they can vote accordingly.

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Guest: European (740 days ago)

Just because you get to vote doesn’t mean you live in a democracy.

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Just because you get to vote doesn’t mean you live in a democracy.

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Guest: (739 days ago)

wrong. if you get a political vote and it is respected that is the definition of democracy. what definition do you have???

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wrong. if you get a political vote and it is respected that is the definition of democracy. what definition do you have???

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Guest: European (739 days ago)

So by your definition if you get a vote and it is not respected you don't live in a democracy.

So therefore I am right not wrong.

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So by your definition if you get a vote and it is not respected you don't live in a democracy.

So therefore I am right not wrong.

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Guest: (739 days ago)

no. a democracy is where you have a vote for your leader. "a form of government in which people choose leaders by voting". nothing about lies nothing about referendums. so therefore you are wrong not right.

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no. a democracy is where you have a vote for your leader. "a form of government in which people choose leaders by voting". nothing about lies nothing about referendums. so therefore you are wrong not right.

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Guest: European (738 days ago)

But by your very words I am right.

Unless you're changing your mind.

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But by your very words I am right.

Unless you're changing your mind.

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Guest: (738 days ago)

by what words? your point was that it is NOT a democracy if the politicians lied to the voters. thats rubbish. my point is that it IS a democracy so long as voters vote for leaders. lies and referendums dont come into it.

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Original comment

by what words? your point was that it is NOT a democracy if the politicians lied to the voters. thats rubbish. my point is that it IS a democracy so long as voters vote for leaders. lies and referendums dont come into it.

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Guest: European (738 days ago)

It's not difficult.

At it's simplist your definition of democracy is:

Vote + respect for that vote = democracy.

It therefore stands to reason that:

Vote - respect for that vote [does not] = democracy.

Original comment

It's not difficult.

At it's simplist your definition of democracy is:

Vote + respect for that vote = democracy.

It therefore stands to reason that:

Vote - respect for that vote [does not] = democracy.

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Guest: (738 days ago)

vote (for leadership) + respect for that vote is democracy. like i keep saying referendums have nothing to do with it and neither do lies. democracys can be absolutely packed with lies and so long as people are still voting for a leader and there votes for that leader are still counted it is still a democracy. i dont see why you dont understand.

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Original comment

vote (for leadership) + respect for that vote is democracy. like i keep saying referendums have nothing to do with it and neither do lies. democracys can be absolutely packed with lies and so long as people are still voting for a leader and there votes for that leader are still counted it is still a democracy. i dont see why you dont understand.

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Guest: (737 days ago)
Latest comment:

Putin for Prime Minister

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Original comment
Latest comment:

Putin for Prime Minister

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Guest: noname (745 days ago)

You are for robbing people of their will. People will accept it or revolt.

Everybody lies. EU has no clue how to deal with immigration and how baddly it will get in next 10-20 years.

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Original comment

You are for robbing people of their will. People will accept it or revolt.

Everybody lies. EU has no clue how to deal with immigration and how baddly it will get in next 10-20 years.

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Guest: noname (746 days ago)

"European" - referendum wasn't close, regions have voted with large majorities to "Leave" or "Remain", and willingness of Scotland to leave UK just to stay in EU, is part of very deep problem that lower classes face both in Scotland and England. Educated and informed usually don't experience this problem personally.

In my opinion only London voted "Remain" for right reasons. It's a prosperous, multicultural city that lived well in EU, and wants to continue as before.

Politicians don’t want to accept the result of referendum, because it’s bad for them and wealthy people they represent, that is way they don’t care about democracy either.

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"European" - referendum wasn't close, regions have voted with large majorities to "Leave" or "Remain", and willingness of Scotland to leave UK just to stay in EU, is part of very deep problem that lower classes face both in Scotland and England. Educated and informed usually don't experience this problem personally.

In my opinion only London voted "Remain" for right reasons. It's a prosperous, multicultural city that lived well in EU, and wants to continue as before.

Politicians don’t want to accept the result of referendum, because it’s bad for them and wealthy people they represent, that is way they don’t care about democracy either.

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Guest: Jim Mooman (742 days ago)

So are you saying a well orchestrated propaganda campaingn of fear and how much poorer they will be failed .... are the idiots not listening anymore ... or do they have a media that cannot be contained ?

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So are you saying a well orchestrated propaganda campaingn of fear and how much poorer they will be failed .... are the idiots not listening anymore ... or do they have a media that cannot be contained ?

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